1992 double die

[J_Dodge]

Searching rolls this morning, I came across this '92 (arrow) which I believe is doubled on the reverse. I've enclosed pics, please examine
and provide feedback.

First the obverse:

GEDC1459b.jpg (155.89 KiB) Viewed 514 times

Now the reverse:

GEDC1470b.jpg (218.32 KiB) Viewed 514 times

Look at the text 'ONE CENT'. I see a 'shadow' next to each character, much like the 1983 pic in the Red Book.

Here is the coin all by itself:

GEDC1478a.jpg (239.36 KiB) Viewed 514 times

I apologize for the pics - no tripod or photo lights....nor does my photo software have a zoom function.

Many thanks

JD

[dirty fingers]

This looks like what is called 'machine doubling'. From what I have read it is caused by a loose die, the die makes an impression, and then while making the impression, 'slides' into place. This appears as a very flat plateau, and on the reverse, that is what it looks like for the cent, and for the memorial.

Now the front looks a little different. There appears to be letters in a double rim, and other things. So, I am also wondering, if this is not a double die, but possibly a double strike, where the coin did not get ejected after being struck, and was struck again.

From what I have read, the machine doubling are not worth premium. This example seems pretty extreme, so you never know. Also, if it is a double strike vs machine doubling, then I think there is an error premium with that.

Kinda hard to tell with the quality of pix. You might take it to a knowledgeable local shop, and see what they think.

[J_Dodge]

df

Thanks for the reply. Again I apologize for the pics - I have issues getting close enough to capture detail w/o the flash destroying the image. I will
try again tonight.

I've been comparing this coin to all the other 92D's I can lay my hands on - I see what you are referring to - the faint line around the Memorial, and the double rim on the front. Thought I was seeing things yesterday when I first spotted the coin.

I've used some differant photo editing software on my pics - was able to "refine" the images a bit.

Front:

GEDC1459a.jpg (122.06 KiB) Viewed 488 times

Back:

GEDC1478b.jpg (57.71 KiB) Viewed 488 times

I hope to get to the area coin shop over lunch today.

Thanks

JD

[dirty fingers]

Have someone knowledgable have a look at it, in hand.

A lot of it appears to be machine doubled ,but could that also simply be some photo 'enhancing' you have done??? The word LIBERTY, does appear like it may be doubled. The characteristic flat plateau does not appear there.

Again, with the pix at hand, trying to make an informed call is not gonna be likely. Keep the coin as pristine as you can (do not handle). Get someone with knowledge to view it 1st hand. There are obvious 'problems' with the coin. If it falls into the category of errors that carry a premium, that is the question. But even if not, if it were my coin, I would keep it no matter what. Heck, even if it worth only 1c, it still is only 1c you are out, lol. And it certainly is NOT normal.

[J_Dodge]

OK - lets try this again....

I changed some settings on my camera - pics aren't as washed out as they were....

Front:

GEDC1487a.jpg (112.26 KiB) Viewed 480 times

Back:

GEDC1488a.jpg (138.37 KiB) Viewed 480 times

JD

[dirty fingers]

Much better.

But again, GET SOMEONE that is knowledgeable to look at it in hand. On the reverse, it does have traits of machine doubling (flat double image). However, it seems like the machine doubling is from multiple directions, and that simply does not happen (I think).

That is why I wonder if this is not a double(or triple, quadruple, ...) strike, and not just what is classified as 'machine doubling'. Double striking IS considered as an error. A 'normal' machine doubling would look just like the T in ONE CENT. There is a very simple flat T under the T. If you look at only the bottom of the C in ONE CENT. The doubling (machine doubling) seems to come from multiple directions. All of the machine doubling I have ever seen, was all from pretty much 1 direction (it can be up, down, left, right, or rotation), and about the same amount. This seems a little different.

One thing that makes me think double striking, is the reverse, ALONG with the way the rim is on the front (and a little bit in liberty, and a little in the date).


The coin appears to have little wear, and if you can get whatever error there is with it validated, you may have a very nice specimen.

[TheJonasCollegeFund]

Worn die. No official $$$ double die. I don't think it's machine doubling either. But I also think it's cool and unique.

You can always go to coincommunity.com and join their site. They have a couple of penny error experts that will know what this is.

[J_Dodge]

Guys

Went to the area coin shop over lunch on Friday - the guy behind the counter was kind of grumpy / ornery - as in what was he? - a source of free advice and wisdom? The normal policy of the shop was to charge a small fee (did not say how much) for examining a coin.

I responded that I've been at this for 6 months (the truth), and knew no one else to turn to - so he relented and looked at it - no charge.

He indicates that it is definitely odd - that both sides have issues - but what caused it - he has no idea. He went for his red book, but his has the same pics mine does (a 1983), and no mention of '92's w/ errors. His option was that the only way to know for certain would be to get it graded by one of the
grading companies, but it would cost me $50 or so, w/ no guarantee of the out come....ie

1) they refuse to grade it as the coin is "to old" - a circulation coin, which seems odd - given the color and cleaness of the coin/readability, etc

2) they refuse to grade it, as they have no other example of the same error in another coin

3) they grade it

He also suggested that I could store it in a coin case (the white cardboard thingies), and sit on it for 10yrs, and watch to
see if any others show up like it. So we cased it - prevent further scratches, etc.

He was of the opinion that the grading services have issues dealing with the first time they see a coin w/ a given error.

If it were your coin - what would you do?

If you say get it graded - Any recommendations as to which grading service to use?

Many thanks for the feedback - appreciate it.

JD