Realcent.org

No82s wrote:http://www.kennecott.com/slideupdates/bingham-canyon-mine-north-wall-slide-update

It's over 15% of the US supply, but who knows what games Wall Street will play to keep the cost of copper down. Since cheap copper is a driver of the economy, I think they'll throw everything they have at keeping the price steady.

Some of the mining byproducts may see big price increases.

From Wikipedia:

As of 2010, Kennecott Utah Copper is the second largest copper producer in the United States and provides about 13-18% percent of the U.S.'s copper needs.[9][10] Kennecott’s Bingham Canyon Mine is the largest man-made excavation in the world, and is visible with the naked eye from space.[9][10][11] It is one of the top producing copper mines in the world with production at more than 18.7 million short tons (16.7 million long tons; 17.0 Mt). Every year, Kennecott produces approximately 300 thousand short tons (272 kt or 268 thousand long tons) of copper, along with 400 thousand troy ounces (13.7 short tons 12.4 tonnes, or 12.2 long tons) of gold, 4 million troy ounces (124 tonnes, 137 short tons or 122 long tons) of silver, about 10 thousand short tons (9,100 tonnes or 8,900 long tons) of molybdenum,[9] and about a million short tons (910 kt or 890 thousand long tons) of sulfuric acid, a by-product of the smelting process.[11]

I am confident that Rio Tinto can have the mine running with limited production within a few months and full production within a year or so. Smaller slides are common in all pit mines. This slide was a big one that affected some of the infrastructure, but not so large that it cannot be worked through once the damage is properly assessed and a plan put in place to restart operations.

It's simple, establish control of a commodity. Drive price upward slowly to develop a gradual upward trend. Keep driving the price up until the general public/news channels starts chattering about the money to be made in investing in copper. Let general public cast their hard earned money in (the boom is near, and big dog is salivating). When taxi cab drivers start telling you how they are about to get into copper, RUN. This is when the big dogs yank the carpet out from Average Joe, then manipulate downward, as a high copper price does nothing to benefit their paper endeavours. RESULT: Average Joe cannot believe he missed out on another opportunity and invested right at the top. RESULT: Big dog wins.
-Experienced Big Dog

CU later 29 wrote:It's simple, establish control of a commodity. Drive price upward slowly to develop a gradual upward trend. Keep driving the price up until the general public/news channels starts chattering about the money to be made in investing in copper. Let general public cast their hard earned money in (the boom is near, and big dog is salivating). When taxi cab drivers start telling you how they are about to get into copper, RUN. This is when the big dogs yank the carpet out from Average Joe, then manipulate downward, as a high copper price does nothing to benefit their paper endeavours. RESULT: Average Joe cannot believe he missed out on another opportunity and invested right at the top. RESULT: Big dog wins.
-Experienced Big Dog

Yeah, I'd say that pretty much covers it.

At this rate, they'll be minting 95% cu cents again by 2015

I'm glad copper isn't down as much as gold and silver today. I was worried it might be under 200% on coinflation.

Still, the dropping copper price really annoys me. I thought that while gold and silver do well in a bad economy, copper does well in a good economy. If stocks are high, gold is low, and everything's wonderful, why is copper down? And you guys think it will keep going down? Damn it. Really. I just wasted so much time stacking copper pennies, didn't I?

Well, I'll take those things to my grave before I dumb them back at the bank. Screw this.

I'm not joking. I'm melting them down, ban or no, and making a damn coffin. Like hell are they going back to the bank.

scyther wrote:I'm not joking. I'm melting them down, ban or no, and making a damn coffin. Like hell are they going back to the bank.

I'm pretty sure it's legal to do that for your own use. You just can't melt them down to sell.

Engineer wrote:

scyther wrote:I'm not joking. I'm melting them down, ban or no, and making a damn coffin. Like hell are they going back to the bank.

I'm pretty sure it's legal to do that for your own use. You just can't melt them down to sell.

Indeed, I thought of that just after posting. Maybe I'll inlay my sarcophagus with all my silver on the outside, to remind all who witness it of the great wealth that silver represented in 2012. And maybe I'll get myself an inner sarcophagus of pure gold, just like Tutankhamun's. Gold will be like $10 a pound by the time I die, so I may as well go for it!

scyther wrote:

Engineer wrote:

scyther wrote:I'm not joking. I'm melting them down, ban or no, and making a damn coffin. Like hell are they going back to the bank.

I'm pretty sure it's legal to do that for your own use. You just can't melt them down to sell.

Indeed, I thought of that just after posting. Maybe I'll inlay my sarcophagus with all my silver on the outside, to remind all who witness it of the great wealth that silver represented in 2012. And maybe I'll get myself an inner sarcophagus of pure gold, just like Tutankhamun's. Gold will be like $10 a pound by the time I die, so I may as well go for it!

Scyther:

I like the way you think. I'm thinking we could make sarcophaguses or sarcophagi (whatever spelling you like best) out of pine on the outside for disguise then layer (outside to in) copper, silver, gold in Troy ounce, 5 gram, single gram sheets respectively. Then the kids wont need to use safe deposit or wall safe and will be forced to visit once in a while.

Copper is dropping lower today.

scyther wrote:

Engineer wrote:

scyther wrote:I'm not joking. I'm melting them down, ban or no, and making a damn coffin. Like hell are they going back to the bank.

I'm pretty sure it's legal to do that for your own use. You just can't melt them down to sell.

Indeed, I thought of that just after posting. Maybe I'll inlay my sarcophagus with all my silver on the outside, to remind all who witness it of the great wealth that silver represented in 2012. And maybe I'll get myself an inner sarcophagus of pure gold, just like Tutankhamun's. Gold will be like $10 a pound by the time I die, so I may as well go for it!

Time for some totally worthless trivia inspired by Scyther who is probably starting to look more and more like his Arkansas convict avatar every day.

Paige Kimble won the 1981 Scripps National Spelling Bee with “sarcophagus,” a word that any middle schooler who has studied a unit on the boy king Tutankhamun can use with aplomb.

I remember watching Paige win it all with my dear mom.

shinnosuke wrote:
Time for some totally worthless trivia inspired by Scyther who is probably starting to look more and more like his Arkansas convict avatar every day.

Paige Kimble won the 1981 Scripps National Spelling Bee with “sarcophagus,” a word that any middle schooler who has studied a unit on the boy king Tutankhamun can use with aplomb.

I remember watching Paige win it all with my dear mom.

Well, she can spell a lot better than me. I got wrong the first time. Luckily my computer has spellcheck. And I didn't what aplomb meant either

(By the way, "You may only embed 3 quotes" is getting pretty annoying)

There are huge warehouses full of copper, and storage is at an all time high. If anything they are propping up copper prices by keeping all that copper off the market and out of usage.

How low can it go? Think we'll ever see copper pennies under face? Think we'll ever see nickels over face again?

Half of what's killing copper (and hell, killing everything) is American equities. I know people who are dying to get AT&T or Verizon's stock with those sweet dividends, but I can't seem to find any investors, or investment banks or firms that are moving into any form of commodities. The other half that's hurting are these crappy economic reports from China, America, and the European Union that have been coming out the past 2 months.

Here's one thing that's important to understand: corporations can still rake in massive profits in an economy that's on the upside, but not roaring yet. This recession allowed companies to cut work force to the bone, cut their hours, cut their benefits, and get away with it because they could tell their employees they were lucky to still have a job. And their profits soared as a result. Now that these companies are having record profits and earnings again they still aren't hiring that much, because they don't want to let go of the aforementioned formula this past recession gave them.

So in an economy that's on the upside, but not roaring yet American equities are what everyone is pushing their money into. They're pushing everything down.

Ecotic wrote:Half of what's killing copper (and hell, killing everything) is American equities. I know people who are dying to get AT&T or Verizon's stock with those sweet dividends, but I can't seem to find any investors, or investment banks or firms that are moving into any form of commodities. The other half that's hurting are these crappy economic reports from China, America, and the European Union that have been coming out the past 2 months.

Here's one thing that's important to understand: corporations can still rake in massive profits in an economy that's on the upside, but not roaring yet. This recession allowed companies to cut work force to the bone, cut their hours, cut their benefits, and get away with it because they could tell their employees they were lucky to still have a job. And their profits soared as a result. Now that these companies are having record profits and earnings again they still aren't hiring that much, because they don't want to let go of the aforementioned formula this past recession gave them.

So in an economy that's on the upside, but not roaring yet American equities are what everyone is pushing their money into. They're pushing everything down.

Never thought we'd see you here again. Welcome back!

Ecotic wrote: The other half that's hurting are these crappy economic reports from China, America, and the European Union that have been coming out the past 2 months.

Here's one thing that's important to understand: corporations can still rake in massive profits in an economy that's on the upside, but not roaring yet. . . . Now that these companies are having record profits and earnings again.

So in an economy that's on the upside,. . .

?

Interesting, crappy economic reports for months from the world's major economies couples with companies having record profits I can agree with. An economy on the upside? Don't see it here in America.

Growth as we knew it is gone having been based on cheap oil (energy) and debt. The way the world has worked is changing to something else. However, the top of the power pyramid structure doesn't want or like change and is throwing everything at it they can to keep things from changing to fast and causing the common man from . . . well, lets just call it rejecting the status quo.

I can't tell you exactly what the future scenario will be, but it doesn't look pretty. People smarter than I are giving the corporate/government power structure increase (can you imagine an American Fascism based on the Italian concept of a marraige between the major corporations and government?) You don't have to look very far, and many have been watching it go this direction for decades.

Imagine the Fascist State controling the declining energy avaliable and deciding where on the distribution scale the priorities are. Or shifting world power based on the ability of the military might to either take or pursuade contries with needed resources to either join up with the coersive State or be adsorbed.

Nope, not pretty.

johnbrickner wrote:

Ecotic wrote: The other half that's hurting are these crappy economic reports from China, America, and the European Union that have been coming out the past 2 months.

Here's one thing that's important to understand: corporations can still rake in massive profits in an economy that's on the upside, but not roaring yet. . . . Now that these companies are having record profits and earnings again.

So in an economy that's on the upside,. . .

?

Interesting, crappy economic reports for months from the world's major economies couples with companies having record profits I can agree with. An economy on the upside? Don't see it here in America.

Growth as we knew it is gone having been based on cheap oil (energy) and debt. The way the world has worked is changing to something else. However, the top of the power pyramid structure doesn't want or like change and is throwing everything at it they can to keep things from changing to fast and causing the common man from . . . well, lets just call it rejecting the status quo.

I can't tell you exactly what the future scenario will be, but it doesn't look pretty. People smarter than I are giving the corporate/government power structure increase (can you imagine an American Fascism based on the Italian concept of a marraige between the major corporations and government? You don't have to look very far, and many have been watching it go this direction for decades.

Imagine the Fascist State controling the declining energy avaliable and deciding where on the distribution scale the priorities are. Or shifting world power based on the ability of the military might to either take or pursuade contries with needed resources to either join up with the coersive State or be adsorbed.

Nope, not pretty.

Lately I've seen that marriage called corporate cronyism. It's not what you know; it's who you know. Government bureaucrats take the revolving door to lucrative careers in the industry they regulated. The titans of Wall Street run a Central Bank somewhere or get Cabinet level positions or agency directorships. Throw in academia where too many toe the party line and it's a big mess. So, as you said, our "prosperity" was built on debt which cannot defy gravity forever. As for what happens nest, see my signature.